#436 – The Mail-Right Show: The Changing World of SEO In 2024 & What You Need to Know!

With Special Guest Eric Preston From AgentLaunch

The Changing World of SEO In 2024 & What You Need to Know!

With Special Guest Brandon Leibowitz of Seooptimizers.com.

Mastering SEO in 2024: Essential Tips & Tricks Real Estate Agents Need to Know to be Successful in an Ever-Changing Online Environment!

Ready to take your real estate business to new heights? Dive into our must-watch video on Mastering SEO in 2024 for real estate agents! Explore crucial tips and tricks to keep you competitive in an ever-changing digital world. From optimizing local listings to building backlinks, this show covers it all. You can elevate your online visibility and drive more traffic toward success.

#1 – Brandon, can you give the audience some info on your background and how you got involved in the semi-crazy SEO world?

#2 – What are some of the leading things you think real estate agents and brokers need to understand connected to SEO in 2024?

#3 – Can you give us a couple of mistakes people make regularly connected to SEO?

#4 – Can you provide one or two case studies of how you have recently helped individuals or companies?

#5 – How will AI change real estate SEO in the next 18 months?

#6 – If you had your time machine (H. G. Wells) and could travel back to the beginning of your career and business journey, what essential piece of advice would you give yourself?

Episode Full Show Notes

[00:00:12.930] – Robert Newman

Welcome back, ladies and gentlemen, to the Mail-Right podcast. Today’s episode is number. Today, John lobed me a softball and decided to make the subject of the show, The Changing World of SEO in 2024. And we have this stellar Brandon Leibowitz of Seooptimizers.com. Did I say that right?

[00:00:47.190] – Brandon Leibowitz


[00:00:48.080] – Robert Newman

Perfect. With us to help us discuss what you need to know in 2024 about SEO. So before we go into it, Brandon, our audience, or at least maybe 80% of them, are going to know who we are. They are not going to know who you are. Why don’t you jump in and give us a little bit of background in detail on who you are what you do, and why you feel comfortable talking about SEO with us?

[00:01:15.240] – Brandon Leibowitz

Definitely, thanks for having me on. My name is Brandon Lebowitz, and I have been involved with digital marketing since 2007. I graduated from college and got my degree in business marketing. After I graduated, the first job I got out of school was helping a company out with digital marketing, which I didn’t really know much about back then. They said, Don’t worry, we don’t know much either, which I thought was interesting. And they said, We’re going to learn with you, take you to classes and workshops and seminars. And did that for a few months and just realized everyone’s probably going to have a website in the future. And there’s lots of different ways to get traffic, such as social media, email marketing, paid ads, and SEO. And I just focused more on SEO because I thought, Who doesn’t want free traffic? And over the years, I worked at different advertising agencies as a director of SEO. Before work and after work on my lunch breaks, I worked on my own company and eventually built that up to where I was able to quit my job and focus solely on this, helping people just tap into that traffic from Google.

[00:02:14.920] – Robert Newman

Beautiful. All right. I’ve got many questions stemming even from your introduction. But before we do that, I want to make sure that we credit the guy who runs the MailRight show. And I’m going to do a little bit of a drum roll. Brandon, I don’t know that you know what the background is, but John is a WordPress legend. He has another show called WP-Tonic. It’s literally one of the biggest shows on the subject of WordPress. He’s had a massive list of luminaries come on his show, Matt Molenwig, Rand Fishkin, the list goes on and on. It makes me jealous that we can’t get all those people. We’ve had our fair share, but we have yet to have all those people on this show. So he knows all the stuff about WordPress. He also happens to be a founder in the real estate space. He is building out using his extensive knowledge, turning WordPress into a tool for all real estate agents and brokers, and doing a hell of a job at doing it. That’s my introduction. John, how would you describe yourself?

[00:03:25.890] – Jonathan Denwood

I’ll send you the check. Thanks so much, Rob. Yes, I’m the joint founder of Mel-right. Com. We build great-looking websites, but we give you a lot more than that. We give you a CRM landing page functionality, social media Canada, and a lot more all in one package. And it’s just a fantastic platform. And I just want to say, if you’ve got any questions, why don’t you join us? This show, we do it around 2:00 PM I’m every Thursday, Pacific Standard Time. You can join us through YouTube or the Mel Wright Facebook page. And if you’ve got any questions, you can ask them during the show, and we will attempt to answer them. That’s it. Back over to you, Robert.

[00:04:19.590] – Robert Newman

Okay, I’d like you to copy me. With that, I’m going to ask the two… You know what? I’m the founder of Inbound REN. We are an SEO company and an inbound marketing company. I’ve been focused on residential real estate agents for longer than most people have had careers. I’m excited to get into today’s topic. If you want to learn anything about me, just go to inboundrem. Com because a good SEO guy always has a lot more information published than they do when you’re going to talk to them. I have hundreds and hundreds of articles and all sorts of stuff on my website. So go check it out. Now, diving into it, if you could do me a favor, John, because I want to share the show on my channel. So just if you could go ahead and dive into question number two, while I share, sure.

[00:05:10.390] – Jonathan Denwood

So, Brendan, what are there a couple of things you think real estate agents and brokers really need to understand connected to SEO, especially in 2024, because of various factors? It’s changing, it always is. But I think, I don’t know if you would agree with this, over the last year or 18 months, I think that pace of change is acerated in some ways. So what are some of the key things you feel that this particular audience really needs to understand?

[00:05:44.710] – Brandon Leibowitz

There is a lot that can be done. I would say, well, one aspect is Google business profile. So if you’re local, you want to try to have a presence on Google Maps, which is Google business profile. And having that is great because I do see a lot of real estate agents that unfortunately don’t have their own website, and they think they have a website, but it’s hosted on one of these big corporate websites, and it’s not really theirs. They just have a page. So I always tell them, you need to have your own website. I like that. You’re hopefully telling them to build their websites and claim their own website, build it on WordPress, own it, take ownership. Don’t be on some other third party platform because you don’t have full control because that limits what you can do with that CEO. So if you don’t have full control, Google business profile is a way that you can have full control and try to get that presence on the maps and just try to capture more real estate on that first page of Google so you could just get more traffic.


[00:06:41.680] – Jonathan Denwood

Yeah. Anything else? What’s the second thing that you think is really important?


[00:06:46.530] – Brandon Leibowitz

Content. So content is always very, very important, meaning text. Google feeds off text. They struggle with images and videos. I mean, they’re getting much, much better at it, but they really want text on every single page on your website. So just adding more content. And a lot of people are looking at AI to help with that, which Google said a few months or last year that we don’t care who writes the content. If AI writes it, it’s fine, as long as it’s accurate and helpful and beneficial. So if you want to have AI help write like outlines, I’m going to just have it write your content because it’s not perfect yet, but it is getting there. And that could just be something that assists people because a lot of people don’t have time to write content for their website or to keep their blogs updated. And that is really important for Google.


[00:07:35.050] – Jonathan Denwood

Great. Over to you. Over to you, Robert.


[00:07:39.940] – Robert Newman

Thanks, John. All right, well, we still You accidentally stumbled into a hot topic with me because I actually usually recommend the exact opposite of what you just said. But I don’t really want to get into a debate about the benefits or judgment call on AI on this particular show because we’ve spoken about it in vast quantities in other shows that we’ve done. I just want to make a footnote that I don’t necessarily agree, but I understand your point of view. I respect your point of view. Just so that we can get an understanding of… I’m going to skip. I’m going to mix up one of the questions, John. I’m going to shuffle number three to number four, which is, can you give us an example of a couple of companies that you’re working with or a couple of maybe case studies that would illustrate your point, like customers that you’ve worked with, changes that you’ve made, results that you saw, what you did and what happened?


[00:08:45.180] – Brandon Leibowitz

Yeah, definitely. And I would not recommend just using AI to write your content just as an outline, if you get stuck on stuff. But yeah, AI, definitely don’t use it. Don’t rely on it. It’s just a tool to help you out. And it’s good for coming up with blog post topics or writing outlines, but writing content, I would still much rather use humans because it’s much more accurate. But in terms of case studies, and clients I’ve worked with in general, I have a whole gauntlet. One that I’m We’ve been working with for the past couple of years was they have exotic cars that they lease out, and they’ve been around for 25 years, and they’ve had a lot of authority built up to their website. But the way the website was built It was just Google was not able to read it, wasn’t able to crawl it, and that caused them not to get ranked for a lot of the keywords that they wanted to rank for. And by going in, cleaning up all the coding, actually having to rebuild the site, unfortunately, this one was just built in a way that was not crawlable for Google.


[00:09:47.500] – Brandon Leibowitz

Building in a new way that let Google find the pages, read the pages, look at the coding, seeing a title tag, descriptions, header tags, all these technical things that Google wants to see, pretty much shot them up to that first page of Google within two months. Usually it takes a lot longer, but this site is a really old website that has a lot of domain authority and a lot of backlinks built up to it. So Google trusted it, they just couldn’t read it. And by going in and making those changes, they moved up really fast, where usually most clients I work with, it’s the other way around, where they have a website built and it’s been only built for a year or a couple of years old, and they don’t really have many backlinks. And that’s where we got to go in and start building more backlinks to get Google to trust them and see that they’re relevant and authoritative. And that takes a lot more time. Building backlinks, getting Google to trust you is not something that you do overnight. It takes months, if not much longer, depending on how competitive those keywords are.


[00:10:42.890] – Brandon Leibowitz

But by building the right backlinks and sending the right signals of relevant and authoritative backlinks to those websites, slowly they start moving up, gaining that traction and getting to that level of placement that they want to be at.


[00:10:57.280] – Robert Newman

Copy you. I John, I’m going to throw a doosy in here. I’m curious to know if you want to go before me, though. I’m going to go off script. I’m curious to know, Brandon. So recently there’s been Ran Fishkin leaked. He was hit up by somebody who had gotten a hold of 2000 documents that were API coding references that were believed to be from Google directly, a mistake, uploaded to GitLab. It’s been setting the SEO world on fire because for the first time ever, we think that we may have some very specific actionable ways of what Google is looking at. And in those documents, it’s not necessarily the things that they’ve been telling us all these years. So I’m curious to know, have you seen anything about that? And if you have, do you have an opinion about any of it?


[00:12:03.650] – Brandon Leibowitz

Yeah, that leak is pretty big right now and will probably stay very important for a long time. And a lot of stuff that Google tells us not to do actually is ranking factor. And I can’t really trust Google or any of the faces they put out there, like Matt cuts back in the day and all these people that were telling you what they, what Google wants, which is not really in Google’s best interest. They’re not going to tell you how to rank websites. I mean, they might tell you some things, like in the past, they were saying, We’re having this mobile update. If your website is not mobile friendly, we’re not going to show you on mobile devices because that helps their bottom line out. They want a good user experience. They want someone searching on mobile to click on a Google list result, go to a website, be able to read it, scroll through it. And if it looks bad, eventually people are going to be like, Google, what’s going on? Why are you showing me results that I can’t read these websites? And they’re going to go to Bing or Yahoo or DuckDuckGo or some other search engine.


[00:12:57.150] – Brandon Leibowitz

So when it’s in their best interest, they’re going to let you know. But in reality, they’re not going to tell you really what goes on in the rankings. And a lot of stuff that they talk about, like clicks, like how many people search on Google and click on your result. That had a big impact. When I first started doing SEO back in 2007, I built my website and would test that out where I would go to different… If I was working at a Starbucks, it’s a different IP address, and I would search my company name or keywords related to my company and click on it and see what happened. And I would start moving up those rankings And Google says that’s not part of the ranking with them, which now we could see it is or Chrome, the data from there. They never looked at that. But I always try to bookmark all my websites and my clients’ websites in Chrome, just so Google sees that they’re bookmarked and hopefully reads that and just trying to think outside the box in any way possible just to appease Google because the links, they’re cryptic the way they name things.


[00:13:55.710] – Brandon Leibowitz

But there were some words that stuck out and we were able to decipher, but a lot of it was cryptic and wasn’t the easiest, like domain authority or page rank, still part of their algorithm and things like that. So whatever you hear Google say, just take it with a grain of salt. They’re not really telling you what’s in your best interest. They’re telling you what’s in Google’s best interest.


[00:14:17.370] – Robert Newman

So I’m going to close out the segment of the show, and I’m going to give you a chance to chew on this. We’re going to go to break at the 15 minute mark, which is in about 30 seconds, maybe a minute. So So I, long before the leak, long before the leak, was propositioning that Google must be using Chromium as a major tracking and ranking factor across their algorithms. There was no proof to that. As a matter of fact, they oftentimes alluded to or denied the idea that they were using Chrome as this major… Because they were worried about violating privacy laws. It’s my guess. This is all just an opinion. It was all an opinion. But it didn’t seem logical to me that they’d be running a company this big when they took all the time to build Chromium, how much they pump Chromium, how many deals they’ve made around Chromium, how many people use Chromium. It would be absolute insanity not to use it as the backbone of your algorithm since about 80% of the world uses it as a browser. It turns out that with a hack, that if indeed it is really a hack from Google, that there is indeed tracking metrics inside Chromium, lightweight APIs, in this case called Navboost.


[00:15:35.490] – Robert Newman

Navboost tracks exactly as I had been guessing that it was user behavior tracking That’s probably by clicks and length of visit because those would be the things would be easiest to track using an API. Indeed, that seems to be the case with some other added elements into it. There’s some factors that just rocked me to the core, the fact that they absolutely positively have a negative factor now built into exact match domain names. They’ve said it, by the way, for everybody listening to the show, for Brandon, in case you didn’t… They’ve said they were not being as gentle with them, but they didn’t come up directly and say, We’re going to penalize you. We’re going to mess you up if you have a direct match domain name, which is just It’s heart-wrenching for all the people that have spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on direct match domain names. Anyway, here’s the question. How big of a result have you seen when you focused on things like user behavior? Because something you said earlier goes directly against what John and I say, which is, and I just want to be honest with you about it, John and I have been screaming video as long as there’s been a male It’s a podcast.


[00:17:01.250] – Robert Newman

Well, actually, I’m so sorry. Since the moment I joined the podcast, which was like three and a half years ago or three years ago, something like that. We’ve been saying video, video, video. All the updates Google is making are saying video, video, video. All the results that I’m getting, say, video, video, video. All the things that I see are time on page in terms of ranking factors, video being 80% of the world consuming it, adding it to a page as long as it’s engaging, easiest way to add that page, hang time, as long as you’ve sent a mechanical URL signal to Google that says, Hey, this is the home of where the video lies. For me, for John and I, like shortcut hack to real estate agents, it’s like, number one thing we’re talking about is video. And earlier on, you were like, not so much. I want to let you chew on that and then come back to us with a response after After the break, we can draw it out if you need a time, like a beat to think about it. So without any further ado, ladies and gentlemen, we’re going to go to break.


[00:18:11.160] – Robert Newman

And when we come back, Brandon is going to share his thoughts with us about the relevance of video for SEO. Perhaps we need to distinguish what customers you’re working with because for us, real estate agents, video is definitely a shortcut of hack. The average real estate agent can do that. Whereas if you said, Let’s spend $10,000 on a really nice piece of content, yeah, the average agent isn’t going to be able to do that. We’ll be right back, ladies and gentlemen, with the amazing Brandon Leberowitz and my amazing co-host, Jonathan Dinwood. We’re going to see what Brandon has to say about video SEO for… Or video as it relates to SEO in 2024. We’ll be right back. You’re going to cut this out and edit it, though, John. Brandon, do you need a beat or are ready to…


[00:19:01.070] – Brandon Leibowitz

No, we can go. We can keep going.


[00:19:03.050] – Robert Newman

Okay, so I’m going to do a countdown, then we’re going to cue the show back up, okay?


[00:19:08.280] – Brandon Leibowitz



[00:19:09.030] – Robert Newman

Three, two, one. Welcome back, ladies and gentlemen, to the MailRight podcast. Today’s episode number is 436, I think. I got it right.


[00:19:21.480] – Jonathan Denwood

You get a stall.


[00:19:23.930] – Robert Newman

That was Hale, Mary. We’re here with Brandon Leewoodson. Before we went to break, we were talking about… Brandon made comment about maybe that he didn’t feel strongly about SEO that made me think that maybe he didn’t think strongly about SEO as Jonathan and I do. I have tried to serve up a question that properly frames that topic, and I’m curious to know what your response is.


[00:19:46.970] – Brandon Leibowitz

Video is definitely very beneficial and helpful. I was just saying at the beginning that content to Google, content Google loves text, and they struggle with images and videos, but they still So you can read potentially them, and they can transcribe them, especially now, like you’re on YouTube, and there’s tools that will transcribe the whole video, or Google will do that for you. Youtube will do that for you. So if you upload a video to YouTube, they’ll try to transcribe it for you or subtitle it. It doesn’t always get it right. That’s why I’m saying it’s not perfect yet. But it is helpful because people don’t want to read content. Nobody wants to read a 500-word article when they can watch a video about it. That’s why if you look at social media, everything is shifted to a video. Instagram is primarily video. There are still images, but it’s primarily video because people just want that visual content. They want that instant gratification, that instant content versus reading it. But in terms of website, I would recommend if you have a video, throw that video up there. And if it’s just a video on that page, I would say transcribe it.


[00:20:48.540] – Brandon Leibowitz

If it’s a really long video, maybe you could timestamp it and break it up in the chapters. But having some text supporting the content around that video just to help with that CEO. So not just having a video as a standalone on your own page, but having a video along with some content there. And definitely the longer people stay on your website, the better off it’s going to be, because if someone just searches, goes to your website, or searches on Google, clicks and goes to your website and then hits that back button, Google sees that and sees how long they were on your website. And if you’re only on it for five seconds, that tells them that your website probably isn’t relevant. And you might be ranked number one, but if enough people hit that back button quickly, then Google is going to say, maybe you should… Let’s try dropping it to number two, and Let’s move number two to number one. And let’s see, do people stay on number one now longer? And if so, then they might keep dropping you down saying your website isn’t really what people are looking for. It ranks for the keyword, but maybe it’s because we’re looking at the wrong signals.


[00:21:43.790] – Brandon Leibowitz

And we also have to look at user experience and how long do they stay on that page. And a video is a great way to keep people engaged versus just throwing them a big block of text where they might say, all right, especially on mobile, this is too much. I don’t want to read all this text. So for SEO, I always say, optimize it for people at the top of your page, above the fold, make it really easy for people to skim through, see your value proposition, your call to action, put a video there or some bullet points so they could quickly skim it. And then, lower down, you could have more text just to help support that for SEO purposes.


[00:22:18.590] – Robert Newman

Copy you. So I’m going to share something with you, Brandon, the spirit of comrade in arms stuff. Oftentimes, I have found myself out in in the middle of at the very bleeding edge of SEO because I’ve been on the phone with real estate agents for 16 straight years. I’ve had thousands of conversations with them.


[00:22:41.180] – Jonathan Denwood

You still seem very calm, Robert. I’m surprised.


[00:22:45.670] – Robert Newman

And there’s this… So oftentimes, real estate agents force you, they ask you such undereducated questions that oftentimes you have to go out there and show them something, prove something. And in the course of doing that, I’ve managed to figure out a few things that are working really well for my clients, for sure, like scoring big, big, big marks. And one of those things is You said transcribing a video, and the way that I understood that, and let me make sure that I did understand that correctly, is I felt like you meant transcribe it to a physical page. Is that right?


[00:23:24.880] – Brandon Leibowitz

Yeah, take it and take that content and put it on the page. Or if it’s on YouTube, you If you put in the description, just put some content around it supporting what that video is about.


[00:23:34.890] – Robert Newman

Got you. I’m pretty sure, because Google, once again, won’t tell you for certain, but I’ve learned this particular hack from some of the biggest video game influencers that exist, and they use it, and I stole it and use it in real estate. There’s these two options, and NAVboost does point to this. It’s closed-captioned. There’s two options when you do a video. One is you can use Rev or something like that, like automated text. Everybody does that. Google, I think, ignores it when you do that. But I’ve always said, and the recent leak seems to show, that there’s a difference in the way that Google handles the video when you manually closed-caption it, when supposedly the purported owner of the video goes through and says, This is what I was saying, and then closed Closed Captions, their video, it is always, for me at least, ranked as if they could understand every word of the video. My thought has been, and still is, is that as long as you do the closed captioning inside the video, you’re actually adding massive pages of text. It’s just pages of text that your end user can’t see, certainly helps Google understand what’s on the video exactly and certainly has done…


[00:24:57.570] – Robert Newman

I’ve done studies with and without this one thing because everything else, VidIQ and all these other services, they’ll point to, and you can do easily. This is the one hard thing. The one hard thing is what has really gotten me massive results. Like, over other people, probably using VidIQ or Tubuddy. Jonathan is a big fan of Tubuddy. But anyway, all right, let’s move on. John, you’ve got number 4 on this.


[00:25:29.020] – Jonathan Denwood

I’m I got lost, but I think we just go to number five. But first of all, Brandon, I just wanted to ask you this because I think Robert’s alluded to it. Do you think all three of us, especially, are we in a bit of a bubble? Because we run businesses about online marketing. But I’m still amazed in the amount of people that don’t even understand the fundamentals of SEO and digital marketing on the people I meet regularly on a day-to-day basis that are reasonably successful. Do you think it’s all a bit of a bubble, or do you think it just depends on what area you’re doing business in or physical area you live in, or do you think we are in a bubble? What’s your views about this, Brenda?


[00:26:30.580] – Brandon Leibowitz

Yeah. I mean, unfortunately, most business owners aren’t too well-informed about SEO. They might know about keywords, try and put keywords on their website, but most of them don’t know about backlinks, or they do know about backlinks They’re building the wrong type of backlinks by going on like, Fiverr and buying a gig and trying to get a thousand backlinks and then realizing they’re all from foreign language sites or blog comments or like, directories that are low quality and PBN type of site. Those people, we unfortunately have to educate them and break it down and let them know what SEO is, the benefits of it, how long it takes. A lot of people aren’t aware of that either. They think that they could just throw some keywords on there and start ranking, and they don’t realize that it takes a lot of time for Google to trust a website, and it’s not as quick and easy as people think. But unfortunately, most business owners aren’t too aware of that or even the fundamentals, SEO might work for them, but it might not also work. I’ve had a lot of people come to me with brand new products, new inventions that don’t really have search volume.


[00:27:39.010] – Brandon Leibowitz

I’m like, it’s going to be a little tricky unless we start ranking for keywords that are related to your product, but it’s not exactly what you’re offering. So sometimes SEO doesn’t always work or you’re just selling T-shirts and you’re dominated by big corporate websites and trying to compete with them is going to… It’s not really feasible. I mean, if you have a big budget, you can. But in reality, it’s probably not that you’re going to be able to break into. Just trying to set expectations is one thing that I try to do ahead of time with clients and just letting them know maybe this isn’t the best option, but social media or doing some other Google ads or trying to give them alternatives. So they’re not just left saying, All right, this wasn’t helpful, but giving them alternatives because everyone really is online nowadays. If you’re not online, you’re missing out on potential a lot of people. Just trying to figure out where are your clients? How do I get in front of people when they’re looking for my product or service. And sometimes it might be different areas that you might not have thought of, and you have to get creative with that.


[00:28:36.450] – Jonathan Denwood

Fantastic. Back over to you, Rob.


[00:28:39.300] – Robert Newman

So we’re going to do a thought experiment and use you as our foil. Once again, John and I have talked about this. We’re excited to have an SEO guy on the show to give us a third outside opinion on this subject. And this is obviously, if you don’t have a lot of real estate clients, this is just going to be guesswork. We are asking you to guess, not know. So our number five question was, how do you believe the AI might change SEO in the next 18 months or so? If you just had to guess.


[00:29:16.960] – Brandon Leibowitz

I mean, that part, it just depends. So for content creation, things like that, I feel like everyone’s going to start using that more and more. And it comes down to making sure the content is accurate and helpful and beneficial, not just going to ChatGPT and say, write me a blog post about 10 neighborhoods to live, to check out in Los Angeles. It’s not going to give you the best results, but if you use it as more of a starting point and say, maybe help me write an outline, that’s going to be much better. But I see a lot of people just copy and pasting it and throwing it up there because they see other people that are doing it and say they get results.


[00:29:53.990] – Jonathan Denwood

Can I intervene, Brandon? Because I think you’re so right. But Because there are people on the internet that have promoted AI content, especially building niche websites. They say, Use this tool or the other tool, and write 600 articles about a niche subject that you know nothing about for affiliate marketing purposes. And they’ve been hammered by Google, but it’s obvious they’re going to be hammered by to Google because the actual worth of that content, they don’t even edit it. They don’t even know anything about the subject, do they, Brenda? So what do they think was going to happen? Do you think I’m on the right track?


[00:30:45.190] – Brandon Leibowitz

Yeah. I saw people that were throwing up hundreds of pages a day. I’m just like, all right, this is probably a red flag to Google. A typical website would have fewer pages being created, just like backlinks. You can only build a few backlinks at a time. That looks really weird. How did all of a sudden get all these backlinks? Same with pages. How can you write hundreds of pages every single day? And it’s all just that AI content that looks good and is readable, but is it really accurate? Is it really beneficial? Is it helping with the user experience? And in the long run, it’s not. And I see a lot of them now that are talking about saying they got penalized, and they’re going in and cleaning it up, removing low-quality content. So you have to test everything. You can’t trust others, And people say until you try it out and test it. But even then, you have to think, is this really the best strategy in the long run? Or is Google eventually going to try to figure this out to stop it from happening? Because that’s what Google does is people find ways to game the system, and Google stops that exploitation.

[00:31:45.240] – Brandon Leibowitz

People are just throwing it out, saying, Look at AI, it’s so easy. It ranks. And, of course, Google will say, We don’t want that to happen. We don’t want you to throw up AI because now how do we know what’s good, and what’s terrible content without looking at all these other variables like authorship and EEAT, things like that?

[00:32:05.400] – Robert Newman

Beautiful. John, if you don’t mind, we’re going to ask for your patience for maybe another 30 to 90 seconds because we’re going to close the show out. Our bonus content is going to be a question that we included in the form that we sent you, which is if you had a time machine, like an HDR Wells-type time machine, and could travel back to the beginning of your career or business journey, whichever you prefer to talk about, what essential piece of advice would you give yourself?

[00:32:34.750] – Brandon Leibowitz

You are getting a mentor sooner rather than later. So mentorship and getting mentors is something that just really helps out in general for business or SEO, or you get multiple mentors, but people that you could talk to bounce ideas off, and they are maybe one or two steps ahead of you in your business career. So you could learn from them, learn from their mistakes. That way, you could try to avoid them and get insights. They’ve really helped my career out a lot. And I waited a long time or didn’t really know about them at the beginning of my career, and then I did know about them, but I just never really jumped on them. And I teach classes at lots of different places. And one place is called score. Org. And if you don’t know of a mentor or can’t find a mentor, you could go to score. Org. And it’s a free resource. And they’ll match you up with mentors. And nowadays, with everything being virtual, it doesn’t matter if you’re in that same city and you can find a mentor that would really help you, guide you along your business journey and your career, and help, hopefully, get you to that next level that you’re trying to move up.

[00:33:37.720] – Robert Newman

Isn’t SCOR related to retired COs and things like that who volunteer their time and help people out? I feel like I’ve run across it a few different times. Okay. All right. I’m just making sure that I was thinking of that. I looked it up, but I still need to read it. I feel like I actually know the answer to that question.

[00:33:55.390] – Brandon Leibowitz

It’s part of the SBA, the Small Business Association. So the government funds it, and then SCOR has a bunch of retired CEOs that are like, I want to give out my time and give back to the community. Here, I’m willing to mentor people, give them advice, and guide them.

[00:34:11.800] – Robert Newman

Very cool. I love that. Mentors have made a big difference in my life, so I totally give a thumbs up on that one. Jon, is there anything you’d like to add before we close the show-up?

[00:34:24.420] – Jonathan Denwood

No, I want to thank Brandon for coming on. Obviously, you know your stuff, Brandon, I could tell. And thanks for coming on the show. And spiry with my beloved Robert. But he’s pretty nice to you, actually, Robert. Robert could get even much more spicy than this, Brandon. But he’s in a good I need to die.


[00:34:48.560] – Robert Newman

Well, listen, thank you so much for coming on board. If somebody was going to reach out to you, how would you like people to look you up if they have questions or something that might serve you and them?

[00:35:02.720] – Brandon Leibowitz

The best way to do this is to go to my website at seooptimizers. Com. That’s S-E-O-O-P-T-I-M-I-Z-E-R-S. Com, and they can find my contact information there and many classes I’ve done over the years. I’ve thrown up a free so I could see step by step how to do a lot of stuff that we talked about today.

[00:35:23.440] – Robert Newman

Beautiful. I love it. All right. If you’d like to learn anything about me, it’s inboundrem. Com. My name is Robert Newman. I’ve been the fearless captain of the show, but the guy who makes the show work and run is John, If, Then, Then, Would. John, if you’d like anybody to find you, talk to you about Mailright, talk to you about marketing, talk to you about anything, how would you want them to do that?

[00:35:49.020] – Jonathan Denwood

I think there are two ways. Go to the Mailright YouTube channel and subscribe. We’re always making new content for that. Or go to the Mailright website and have a look around. We’ve got a fantastic blog. We write a load of stuff and video, and you can book a demo, and I can show you the power of Mel Wright. Back over to you, Rob.

[00:36:08.930] – Robert Newman

Cool. All right. Well, ladies and gentlemen, thank you so much for tuning in. We deeply appreciate your earballs today and look forward to getting them the next time you want to learn more about real estate marketing. We’re going to sign off now. Like us where you found us, comment where you found us, and join us next Thursday at 2:00 PM, just like John has been asking repeatedly.

The Hosts of The Mail-Right Show

Jonathan Denwood



Robert Newman




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