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265 Mail-Right Show Building a Digital Marketing Plan Part 2

Where Real Estate Marketing Guides Fail

Most step-by-step guides on developing a real estate marketing plan are general templates.

They teach how to identify your target market and check key performance indicators. They might unpack how to reverse engineer your competition and how to develop a real estate marketing calendar. But the buck stops there.

The other kind of guide lists specific marketing strategies, like blogs and email campaigns. However, they leave out how to effectively incorporate these tactics into a calendar. This is the Ultimate Guide to Real Estate Marketing Plans because it combines both.

We discuss the necessary marketing techniques that everyone should use. We also list many more optional tactics that may appeal to your specific skill set. Then we sync these techniques with a real-life marketing plan, including an example calendar.

No guesswork, no big hanging questions. Just a fantastic real estate digital marketing plan you can see yourself in.

Jonathon: Welcome back folks to the Mail Right Show. This is episode 265 is going to be an internal discussion between me and my great co-host Robert. We had a couple of weeks ago show about why you need a digital marketing plan and you need to get that done. And we only touch the surface. So we’re going to go back to the subject. Robert wrote a really extensive article on his website. So make sure you go there and have a look at it. So, Robert, I want you to introduce yourself to the new listeners and viewers, and by the way, you, Robert, we’ve got a lot of new people joining the show. I think this month is going to be our biggest month for downline Robert.

Robert: It’s beautiful. I’m glad that people are finding the show useful, and it’s always, I’m always grateful that you decided to share the numbers with us. So my name is Robert Newman. I’m the founder of a technology and real estate marketing Technology Company that focuses on inbound marketing. And a big portion of that is SEO. Part of what I do is educate people for free. I do a lot of very deep content. I share my 30, 30, 40 years of worth of sales and marketing information.

I know I don’t look that out, but I really am. And a lot of that information goes onto my website. One of the things that John is talking about is how to create a digital marketing plan, why you need a digital marketing plan and you can find a very thorough post on the site. And we’re going to discuss that more during the show. John, before you get started, I’m going to take a moment to take the floor here and hope that you’re going to humor me.

But John and I just finished talking about this, but we want to extend our deepest apologies to a previous guest. It was on the show last week. He was a brilliant gentleman who has had almost as deep of history as I do working for real estate marketing companies. His name was Ricardo Bueno, and a lot of our audience doesn’t know this, John, but you have what’s called auditory dyslexia, which just means that when John is hearing and processing information, he has a very hard time making sense of certain sounds, certain words, which has created a situation where when he pronounces certain surnames somebody’s last name, as we would call it here in the States he struggles with this at times. And he was struggling during the last show. In any way, I wanted to take a moment and I told John, I was going to do it just to explain to our audience, this is not intentional.

John is not doing this on purpose. He’s not even doing it as a joke. And I laugh about it a lot on live, on-air. We, we, it may sound like we’re making light of it and we’re really not. It is merely a matter of he has I don’t know what to call it. Maybe a disability, maybe that’s too strong of a word, but he has a challenge and we move through the challenge as gracefully as we know-how, and sometimes that is not as gracefully as we would like.

Jonathon: Yeah, thanks for that, Robert, because it’s not something I like to talk about. Not because I’m ashamed I got altered dyslexia. It’s like any challenge. And in some ways have no problems saying it a disability, but the problem we’ve used that word is it has a lot of connotations to it. That means that you’re weak or ineffective as a person. And I don’t really want to think of myself like that. And I would have thought a lot of people they’ve done business with me and if use my services definitely don’t see me in that light. So that’s why I don’t like using that. And also I think there are some benefits that I’ve got from having dyslexia.

Because I tend to be able to see the bigger picture and to see how multiple different things fit together in a coherent pathway. And I think a lot of people that don’t have the condition. They really struggle in seeing the bigger picture. And I used to get very frustrated with people. Why can’t you see that this would be beneficial for you if you went down this? Well, they’re not trying to be funny. They just can’t see all the multiple different bits that come together. They just don’t see what I see if that can make sense.

Thanks for doing that, Robert. Because I definitely don’t want to upset anybody or come across that I’m being funny about not pronouncing their last name or anything like that because I’ve definitely not like that. So let’s get on to the digital marketing plan and what I’ve forgotten where we should have listened to the end of the episode a couple of weeks ago, but time goes so quickly. Doesn’t it? Robert. So where do you think we should start this conversation?

Robert: I think that we should probably start it with a deeper dive. So for the audience, what we spent time talking about in the first episode was finding a, when it comes to a find on the marketing plan and we were talking about digital specifically, we talked a lot about trying to figure out the social media or the platform that you would market on. And we spent a little bit of time trying to identify what a natural ability would be in order to promote you on LinkedIn or Instagram or Facebook or YouTube. And we covered a little bit of the pros and cons, but we’re talking about 10 seconds of each inside of each one of these platforms. Now videos like John and I are always hammering away at the video, video, video drum. The funny thing is you can use video on all of these platforms these days.

There isn’t a single one of the ones that I’ve mentioned that has not moved into embracing video on their platform. So simply getting into video would then allow you to open the door, to use the same video across all of these platforms, Twitter, YouTube, LinkedIn, Instagram, Pinterest, almost all of them. There is a course are a couple of exceptions, but not many even tick-tock. And we had a brilliant guest on the show three, four weeks ago that focused on Tik Tok as a method of marketing yourself. But that’s not what we’re going to talk about today. Instead, what I’d like to talk to you about is the concept of measurement, because we did briefly touch on it. And I said at the time that we touched on it, that the idea behind digital was the ability to measure statistics and analyze data. And we, we talked about that briefly.

So how do you start having a conversation with yourself about data? And that I think is best served by having a first conversation about what tools will you use to measure your data when you get it, which is going to play into revising your digital marketing plan about once every three to six months. This is a big, important, important part of digital marketing plans is that you come back and you take a look at them. Like you take a look like if you’re using a lead generation service, you look at your data every six months and make sure that the money that you’re spending is well spent. That’s it! How do you measure that data, John? So the first thing that I’m going to recommend, which is not going to be a surprise to anybody is going to be Google Analytics, which believe it or not can even be used on Facebook.

I know that probably sounds counter-intuitive, but if you’re using a website as a destination, then Google analytics is going to be the tool that you’re going to want to use to measure data. As it relates to a digital marketing plan, you got to have a way to say whatever numbers you’re looking at. You have to have a common language that you speak between you and your plan. And Google Analytics is probably going to be the most universal tool that you can look at. Would you, like I heard you did do a deep side there, John is that was that related to what I said.

Okay. Do you agree or disagree? Or we use where are you sighing? Was there a reason there?

Jonathon: Yeah I think so.

Robert: You think Google analytics is a good, good tool?

Jonathon: Well it’s a little bit complicated setting it up.

Robert: So there are two other tools that you could use that are mentioned inside my plan that is not as complicated, but they’re paid tools. And we did also have a conversation about a third tool. So for those you who are listening to this show, grab your pen, and grab your piece of paper. I know that we give you a lot of information that we theoretically have decided that we’re giving you all this information because that’s why you’re tuning into the show. If you want to learn about real estate marketing, you’ve come in, you listened to us. So HREFS, which is spelled H R E F S, is a tool that you can pay for. Now I have great news for those of you who’ve been following me for a long time.

Those of you are new to me. You won’t know this, but I’ve been talking about HREFS for years. HREFS has a cheaper entry-level plan and they have a free entry-level plan, which is actually kind of awesome. Now it used to suck. It’s actually kind of good. So you get a lot of value out of the free plan. Now with the HREFS, I think they had to compete with tools like Uber to suggest John, and they changed how they were giving away a test sample of their service. So the next tool is SCM rush. That’s spelled at Sam, Edward, and Michael R U S H. And the last tool which we talked about the last time is Neil Patel’s tool Uber suggests. For all of those people who are listening to the show who are looking for ways to start getting smarter and more productive with their marketing.

I’m going to say, you probably want to start with Ubersuggest because Neil Patel has done a better job than anybody else of explaining all the different ways you can use his particular tool. It’s also cheaper than everybody else’s. If you decide to pay for it. It’s $30, maybe $35 a month. Rest is more like 90 and SCM Rush 80. These are really expensive tools that I think for 99% of the real estate industries are going to be overkilled. But on the cheap side of Uber, suggest for $30 a month, I actually do think it’s a good value and that most real estate agents should probably think about using it. It’s also to comment on your point, it’s a much easier tool to use Google analytics and it is a much more intuitive tool to use than Google analytics. So let’s just say that everybody that you now have a tool to prep, to track marketing metrics.

What are you looking at? Like what, why are we talking about this? Well, with digital marketing, even companies like why Lobo and BoomTown and real estate webmasters, and Sierra and track the view when you’re using services, they all have tracking tools. You probably don’t know about them, but they have them. And when you’re having these tools, these tools will show you how many totals, what is your total traffic? Like how many people who’ve seen your advertisement to put it into the simple simplest terms that I know, how. How many people have looked at your advertisement? Why is that important to you? If you’re spending a thousand dollars a month, you should want to know how many people you’re getting in front of traffic sources, where exactly are you or your marketing company whoever’s in charge of your marketing? Where are they getting your views from?

Is it LinkedIn? Is it Facebook? Is it Google? Is it? And if it is Google, what part of Google is it YouTube? Is it images? Is it the hyper-local there are these questions that you should ask yourself, which is basically where is my viewership coming from? The understanding of that particular piece of information will save you or make you a ton of money in and of itself. And the reason I say that John is that I’ve taken countless questions from people, from realtors on Yelp. As an example, they’re always asking me about Yelp. Because they think to themselves, everybody finds their restaurants on Yelp. Why wouldn’t they find their realtors there?

Well, if you ever studied website analytics, as I have you would know that very few of your clients are going to Yelp as a realtor, and that you should probably avoid it. But because most real estate agents pay no attention whatsoever. Even agents who are spending seven to $10,000 a month, they don’t want to have a conversation about where is that money going? They feel like the topic is too broad, and it really impacts the usefulness of your decisions as it relates to your marketing budget, understanding where people go to talk to, to look at real estate stuff is important.

Jonathon: It’s a bit like paying for a billboard. It’s like having a billboard on a B-road where only about a hundred people a day go past it. Or having a billboard on a road that has a thousand people going past it. Which one do you think is going to generate more leads and more money for you?

Robert: Absolutely. And so some of the other statistics that you can get from these tools that we’re talking about, or from Google Analytics is how many new versus return visitors? How long do they stay? When you spend the kind of money like my company charges, which is at least 10 to 20 times more than what a company like John charges. And I’m not trying to say that that means it’s better or worse, by the way, the audience I’m just using it as alike, but you do want to know if you are investing that much more with a guy like me, where’s that money going? Like, I’d want to have that question answered for me. I think it’s so important. I cover it in my initial conversations with my prospective clients. And one of those things where that money goes is, my average session duration. That’s how long do people spend on the things that I build? And the answer is like maybe six, seven, 800% times longer on a site that I built versus others.

Now that doesn’t, by the way, measure out two other numbers that are very important, though. The numbers that real estate agents do understand is how like everybody wants to talk about is how many leads do I get? And that’s a great number, but not all of the value inside real estate marketing plans. These days are the number of leads that you acquire. There are other metrics that you could and should be thinking about. Such as how strong of a lead is it that I’m going to get. If I get one versus a hundred that like if I gave you five leads a month, but they all closed and somebody else gave you 500, but five closed. The value proposition there for the five is, is obvious. Unfortunately, numbers are not that clean, which is why we need to talk about them inside our marketing plan.

Even if you don’t understand what this is supposed to be, you can read some blog posts like mine, and get an average from the blog posts, plug that number into your marketing plan. Like what is my average session duration supposed to be? Or how long is it common for people to stay on real estate websites? How many visitors versus how many leads should I be getting? These pieces of information are absolutely missioned critical for designing a healthy marketing plan. And by the way, this effort for all of those you who are listening, I’m going to talk about this ad nauseum. Because if there’s anything that John and I ever cover, it is going to make you a ton more money. It’s this topic. It understands your numbers, understanding what your money is supposed to be buying you. Does it actually buy you that thing that is supposed to be getting, if it’s visitors then great? If it’s lead quantity then great. But how many of those leads convert into sales and how much effort does it take to get you there on top.

Jonathon: I think it’s great. We can have our break now. And when we come back, we’re going to be delving into this in more detail. We’ll be back in a few moments’ folks.

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Jonathon: We are coming back. We’ve had a real dive there, but I do not know how much of the audience we’ve kept. But I just want to make this point. I think what Robert’s talking about is a really different kind of mindset, which, unfortunately, but for understandable reasons, a lot of agents have. Well, I’m just about to say it has its good aspect and it has its bad days. But the good aspect is that a lot of agents are always looking at technology. The latest trends, trying to implement the latest technology that will help them. And that’s great. But then the bad side is they’re always looking for the next big thing or the next thing that will easily give them the edge.

And will boost their business. What Robert’s really been talking about is having some understanding, which hopefully this show is helping about what really you should be looking at and expecting from a successful digital marketing campaign. The quality of the leads, the exposure you’re getting for your brand. And we’ve discussed this you are building a local brand. And if you are what I call the invisible agent, you’re not going to be very successful no matter what the local market is. So you are trying to build a brand. You are building a real business, and you’ve got to understand in 2020, some of the fundamentals of digital marketing. Do you think that was helpful Robert?

Robert: I do. And I do think that unfortunately for everybody that’s listening, yes. I think that that many people have tuned out or, or understand that maybe this is like taking your vitamins. You understand that you should be doing it, but most of you might not be. But here’s the thing. I thought that this is so important that with the assistance of like, literally my top, top, top content writer, I spent 20 hours of my time, 60 of his, a ton of my own money I created. And this is not a high volume search category in real estate. So I spent all this money and all this time creating something that I think if most of you read it, you will get a much better understanding of how to create a marketing plan for yourself inside your real estate business. And you can find that on my blog.

And I really seriously created this particular post, just to be helpful. It’s not going to make me any money. It’s not going to make you guys call me that it is. It is one of those things where I just feel like you need to have an understanding of this category of knowledge to take your career to the next level. I really believe that with all of my heart. So you just read the posts. If you get lost inside this podcast, if you get lost in general, read the post. I’ve created a calendar in there a hundred day marketing calendar to make it super easy with all the tasks already listed on it. So you could just simply follow the tasks that I’ve assigned you and learn as you go along and you will, you will walk away with your first marketing plan. And once you get it down, it’s just like being in the great battery.

You might need to spend six months in the batting cage and taking a lot of hits. By the time you learn how to bat and swing the bat, it becomes second nature. And like everything else, your future marketing plans will take you 30 minutes. They will not take you forever. You will understand what you need to do. The information will be ingrained inside of you. It’ll be a much faster simpler thing. But by looking at these elements, you’re going to make a lot more money inside your real estate business. You’re going to make a lot better decisions as it relates to your marketing because your decisions will be based on facts and figures, which you can plug into your plan.

And then you can expand your plan, moving on into the years ahead, because you will understand that marketing is like an onion and it should have many layers. And you should have, like, I would say, if he could afford it, you’d hire a guy like John, you focus on Facebook. Then you focus on Google and yes, you’re going to get different quality leads from different places. And then all of these leads should be fed into a single autonomous follow-up system that works the same for every single lead that you ever get.

Jonathon: That’s the thing we discussed with our guest last week. If you get these digital leads in and there’s no consistent follow-up, that level of follow-up really depends on the personal. You need some measuring system about, do they respond to an email? Do they respond to text messages if they do, and that might be automated? Then you need to personally ring that person up and have a one-to-one conversation because this is still barely don’t quite like the analogy, but it is belly to belly. And that is why there’s still a need for a good real estate agent. But you, you need to understand that because if there’s no follow-through and these systems are producing loads of kind of leads. It’s a total waste of time, isn’t it? Robert.

Robert: Yeah. And so here’s one other concept that we talked about. And once again, we touched on it for two seconds, and then we walked away. And this is one of the things I like to talk about the most because this is going to perk every single person who’s listening to this show, their ears are going to go up right now. I promise you because guess what, guys I can tell you. If you learn this stuff, you will understand exactly where your competitor’s business is coming from, which will enable you to decide in an educated way. Do you want to emulate their strategy or do you want to emulate their strategy and then add a couple of layers onto your own strategy? So that you’re not only getting the results that you think that they’re getting but better results. Because between most of you, so I’m going to give you a trick is everybody.

I hope everybody’s listening because I’m going to give you a trick that I use all the time in my consultations on the phone, I’ve been paid a lot of money for this trick. And so I’m going to give it to you all right now. So most of you understand who you think the top real estate website is in the area because you guys have worked for your brokers. You’ve worked for different people, or you are a broker, and you understand who you’re competing against. Maybe you are the top broker in the area that you’re in. Well, somebody could take any one of these tools, SCM rush and plug your website into it and get an understanding of where your traffic is coming from. They can apply the average conversion metrics across the real estate industry to your site. And then they could theoretically come up with the number of GCI that you should be developing off your site.

If you learn these basic marketing digital plan strategies, these are, that’s all information that you should have at your fingertips. I can usually guess in a matter of about 20 or 30 minutes, who the top producing agent in an area is based solely on their digital presence because that’s how important digital has become. It’s not universal, but it’s close. So having said that, here’s the trick though. I can guess, but guess what if I had a good agent on the other end of the phone, I don’t need to guess. And some of you are sitting here already listening to this and you already know what I’m going to say. Which is this many, many, many, many, many MLS allows you to take a look at the transaction totals of your competitors. Almost all of them in California. Do I can go to any agent here in any city, and I can say Bob Corey is somebody I’m looking at.

If I talk to a member of trends, which is Nima last year, a really big one that member of trends can look him up and say, Bob has done 40 transactions for a total of $45 million in total business this year. So guess what? We can take the raw, guesswork the data. We can look at their site, and then we can actually look at their production. And now that we know everybody beyond a shadow of a doubt, are their strategies actually making them money. Because one of the shocking, shocking things that I’ve discovered is that I will oftentimes find a top website run through this exercise with one of my clients. And we will discover that they are making a lot more money, a lot more commissions than the person with a website. This could mean two, one or two things could mean the website’s not working, or the person doesn’t know how to work web leads to easy solutions.

But guess what? All of that information that I just gave you right now during this podcast, it is critical. Can you imagine, cause real estate webmasters will charge you a hundred thousand dollars for a super successful website. So imagine you spend the $100,000 only to discover that like five years later that the person whose website you’re emulating was never making money off it, they were making their money some other way. And so you spent those a hundred thousand dollars that you could have avoided with this five-minute tip that I just gave you right now on the podcast.

The amount of times that I’ve had that happen, John is insane. Insane. So please everybody, that’s listening to the show, do this. If you’re LMS allows you to see what the total production is. Once you find somebody whose strategy you think you might want to add into your own marketing plan, you’re taking elements of what they’re doing, and then you’re adding it to your own marketing plan. Please take the one extra step and take a look at their production and make sure that the products that you’re looking at measures equally to the investment that you’re considering making into your digital marketing plan. Does that make sense to you, John?

Jonathon: It really does. There is only one other mythology that I personally think that works in 2020 and I call it the theme, the mythology Buffini is a consultancy company. That’s very well known in the real estate industry. And my former cohost was a dedicated member as a user of Buffini. But I use it as a shortcut. There are other many Allah coaches and online resources. And basically what it is you. And we’ve had guests on the show that talks about the same mythology that saving 300 people in your database that are pretty close. That would know you visually your name that if you did a post away or each day would respond. And you really market keep close to those 300 people in your local market.

You set up events when we haven’t got a pandemic running. You have live events like an event every quarter that you invite these people to you regularly email them, you regularly find them up to have a conversation. You keep really close and these people because you built a relationship with them, they feel that they become literally representatives of you in your local market. And they send people to you. That’s the only album of 4g in 2020 that I’ve come across. That seems to work well. You reckon Robert.

Robert: Well, I agree with that. And here’s the funny thing that mythology is still a digital marketing plan. And that’s what a lot of people are going to be confused by. But guess what, how are you nurturing those 300 people? Well, number one, because I want to break this down, cause you’ve mentioned it a whole bunch of times. And you’re calling it the Buffini method. There’s a guy out there named Joris who wrote a book called swim with the sharks that is basically a master guide to something like the Buffini method. And what is it at the heart of it? It is a very sophisticated way to nurture your relationships with those 300 people and what, what you would need to do that really well is a very adaptable CRM. So they could track birthdays, graduations dog’s names dog’s birthdays.

And the list goes on. You should have 300 talking points for every single person. That’s what part of the case said is that you need to have 300 talking points because there should never be a time when you can’t think organically of, of a conversation to have with these 300 people. If you’re going to use that method, then you need to know the people that you are, that are on this list that John is talking about. I mean, really know them. Like I know a lot about John is my cohost. It took me a long time to get to know him as a person. But if I wanted to, I could send them a postcard today that would be meaningful to him because I would make sure that I was talking about something that was relevant to his life.

Something about the Reno lifestyle, something about maybe ex-wives like a joke. You know do those things when you’re nurturing a database, the way that John is talking about, but guess what? You’re using email, you’re using postcards, and you’re using fulfillment companies. And all of that information is probably stuff that you’re tracking online. You’re probably using Excel spreadsheets. You’re probably doing stuff you’re probably using a sophisticated CRM. Like I already said, maybe Salesforce would have to be something because you’d have to custom design a really good database or really alter something like outlook to do this.

Jonathon: Yeah. I think we discussed follow her up or something. That’s good. The theme you have their own in. I think you don’t have to be part of Buffini to buy it, but I forgot what it’s called, but they have their own CRM. And it’s really very obviously customized to their mythology, but I think, and I think you can buy it. I think it’s cheaper than follow up boss. Not which is a suburb product, but it’s more, I feel more aimed at power teams than individual agents and maybe line desk. You can do that with line desk as well. I’m not sure about that.

Robert: It’s kind of deep relationship selling. I’ve had a number of conversations with real estate clients about, and they have all lamented over the fact that there is no. So when you start talking about all these data points, like talking points about an individual, about one prospect. They’re like follow-up boss and John you know how strongly I feel about follow-up boss. It is not the right tool. Unfortunately, you’re going to have to go with something more customized. And neither me nor my clients have found that I am super glad that you mentioned that the Buffini CRM if they have something in place. Let’s say even it has 25 data points inside a, like a pre-built contact manager, that’s something that you want to use. You really are very linear.

Jonathon: Because I did look at them and now I don’t have your knowledge of the CRMs like you do, but my co-host religiously used it. Thomas and he had built up his business on the Buffini mythology. So the CRM, which they sell enough, I will have to quantify and I will make sure it’s clarified in the show notes that you can buy without being a member of the Buffini coaching plan, you can buy, I think you can, I will double-check back. But it’s definitely how effective they have done the adaptation. I can’t make a judgment call cause I haven’t got your knowledge. But I’d be surprised if it didn’t fit into their coaching and their mythology.

Robert: And if they have a tool like that, guys, for those that are listening, that is another element of this digital marketing, like making a plan just because I’m digital like I sell digital services does not mean I’m trying to push you in that direction. Nor is John. It might not be right for you might be a very much dedicated relationship salesperson. You might have another career that you’ve been a part of for 30 years and you might be transitioning into real estate. If you’re that person like and you’ve been, let’s say I just got off the phone this morning, oddly enough, with a roofer who got his real estate license and is moving into real estate.

Well, he has hundreds of people he’s done business with as a roofer. That would be a person that would probably be better suited for a Buffini method, kind of startup sales effort than you are. We’re not necessarily the right guys for that, that gentlemen it’s, he is probably better served to use the 300 names that he’s got, make sure that he approaches them in a really sophisticated way. Like for me, I would absolutely spend a few thousand dollars on like postcards and marketing stuff and business cards if I had that kind of database, but in another vertical, but related to the place I was going,

Jonathon: I think you just made a fantastic observation there. But if you’re a new younger agent or a new agent and you haven’t run a company or be a local personality. If we’ve been going to the various local business functions, the chamber of commerce, and I’ve done that. I now run a national company that gets two companies that most of gets its leads from online content and from influencing online. So I don’t really attain much locally, which obviously is difficult at the present moment anyway. But in the past five years I haven’t, but I used to, I used to get most of my clients locally or regionally. So I used to attend all these businesses. And there was a group of people, they were in full-time employment, but they still used to go to all these cause they were inactive sales and they wanted to build relationships.

So they religiously would be at all these events. So if you’re one of those types of people and you get into real estate, what we’ve just been talking about will work perfectly. It will be a great way to look at the Buffini mythology, my shortcut description of it. But if you’re somebody else that hasn’t spent time building those local personal relationships or have them a much lower bar. You might know 10, 12 people really well, but you don’t visually have built up a database and lives of people in your local community. You’re probably going to be better off looking at a digital one of the platforms that we have extensively talked about and using either Facebook or Google ad words. And using a database and a marketing platform and a website to get your leads. Because it’s going to take a long time to build up those 300 people that you’re really close with. If you’re going to go down that Buffini mythology, isn’t it Robert?

Robert: Yeah, yeah. Yes. That is, that is correct. I think we’re at the end of this show and there may very well be. And John is really the one that makes the calls on this, but there’s plenty more to talk about inside.

Jonathon: Yeah, we haven’t yet got a guest for next week. So I think we should finish this off. And I was going to suggest to you, but it’s your call. Maybe the tool that you mentioned which Patel markets and owns that $30 tool maybe. We, obviously, this is altered here. This is all audio but we also have the video up on the Male Right YouTube channel. So maybe we could have a look at that particular tool when, how you can use it to actually do some of the things that we’ve discussed in this particular podcast. How does that sound?

Robert: That is lovely. So stay tuned folks. We’re going to do this. That will be the show for next week. And John is going to allow me the privilege of introducing the show, every other show. So stay tuned for that as I flub it and do what I absolutely got off all job at it, but I will try and we’ll all enjoy my blunders.

Jonathon: Well, that’s great. And we’ll see you next week. I can say it should be a really interesting episode where we show you some of the practical things that we’ve been talking about now. But I think it has been a great show because you do have to understand these two different mythologies, but you can also combine them, which I think is the best. But my observation is that I’ve found people that are really established establish themselves using the Buffini mythology. Find it hard to understand what a real leader is through digital marketing. And the reverse is true.

I’ve found people that have used online advertising. They are not that particularly enameled or they find themselves going, being attracted to the Buffini mythology. That’s the sort of personal observation that I want to share with the audience. We will see you next week. I can say should be a great show. And thank you all, the new listeners and viewers. Thanks. Really appreciate and do, share the show with your colleagues in your office. I’m sure they get value from our conversation and I have great guests. We’ll see you next week, folks

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