We Talk All Things Tech With Leading Los Angeles Broker Peter Lorimer
Peter Lorimer joined Keller Williams Realty, in 2005, where he was the rookie agent of the year. He then went on to have 3 back to back years of being the number #1 agent in his brokerage. Culminating in 2009, where he earned the prestigious distinction of being the #1 top producing Keller Williams agent for the entire LA region, including Beverly Hills, Malibu and Bel Air, and all other areas of Los Angeles County.
Never one to rest on his laurels, in 2010 Peter decided to branch out on his own and launch his long-planned and awaited, PLG Estates based in Beverly Hills. Where he and his team of hand-picked agents cater to a discerning clientele, many of whom are extremely well known individuals with creative tastes but wish to remain fiercely private.
Originally from the UK, Pete had tremendous success as a record producer before coming to the US, working along sides some of the biggest recording artists of the 80’s and 90’s and having over 30 #1’s in the Billboard Club Charts and another 25 around the world. It was his love of working with artists, his creative mindset — and a succession of personal real estate investment deals – that led him into the world of real estate. In 2010, Pete passed another milestone by proudly becoming a naturalized US citizen.
As Pete’s business acumen grew over the years, he realized a tremendous need to assemble a S.W.A.T. team of support staff headed up by his wife and business partner Cindy Lorimer, herself an accomplished businesswoman, whose natural ability for real estate and tremendous attention to detail have helped give PLG Estates its reputation for legendary customer service throughout every step of the transaction. Whether it’s a first-time buyer looking for a $100,000 condo, or a well-heeled celebrity in search of a $10 million beachfront hideaway, every client is treated equally and given top-notch service by one of our team of agents.
When he’s not out with clients or negotiating a deal, Pete’s downtime is spent with his wife Cindy and their kids Emily, Oliver, and Charlotte.
Here’s A Full Transcript of Our Interview with Peter August 2020
Johnathan: Welcome back folks to the Mail Show, this is episode 257. To say I’ve been looking forward to this interview, we’ve got returning guest listeners and viewers we got Peter back on the show. So, I’m going to let Peter introduce himself to you, listeners and viewers. He came on the show over a year ago, I think it’s like 18 months ago, and I’ve been thinking I should have him back and then I finally got him back on the show. So, Peter, would you like to introduce yourself?
Peter: Yes. Greetings. Nice to be back on the show, I thank you for having me, Mr. Denwood. And just for those of you out there who are not sure who the hell is this other dodgy sounding English bloke, I am a broker-owner of a fierce indie in Los Angeles called PLG Estates. We tend to cater to the kind of more creative clientele of LA. And I …
Johnathan: That’s a diplomatic way of putting it, Peter.
Peter: Well part of my job is being the diplomat Johnathan. And then I also host a show on Netflix called Stay Here and was a former record producer house music All Night Long. I had about 50 number ones between the UK and the U.S and then I like to take long walks on the beach and enjoy chocolate. Apart from that, I am just a regular Joe.
Johnathan: He laughs at my jokes, listeners and viewer as well actually, unlike many of our guests that look a bit shocked when they’re exposed to the English humor. Actually, Peter actually gets it. And I’ve got my beloved cohost, Robert with me. Robert, would you like to quickly introduce yourself to the new listeners and viewers?
Peter: Make sure you get your details, correct Robert. Yeah.
Robert: I know…
Peter: Make sure that…
Robert: It’s a little bit embarrassing that I got your name wrong. Matter of fact, if f I’m not mistaken, our paths have crossed but we’ll figure that out in a little bit.
Peter: I was acquitted.
Robert: I am the founder of the Inbound Real Estate Marketing, which is a company that focuses on lead generation through SEO for real estate agents. If you want to learn more about me, you can go to inboundrem.com. How’s that for concise John?
Johnathan: That’s great. So, let’s start off the interview Peter, let’s start off with a dismal start. Let’s talk about the pandemic and doom disaster and darkness. So, how has it affected your own brokerage the last five months and how do you see the till the end of the year things panning out Peter?
Peter: Well, on that cheery note, let me jump in. So, funny enough, I was slinging houses back in 2008 and I remember really the kind of the sky falling back then, and in March this year, obviously, as things began to explode, I’m like this feels familiar, this feels kind of like 2008 again. And I looked at my missus, who is my partner in the business, and I’m like here we go get ready. And what happened certainly for me and for LA, I don’t know what it’s like for the rest of the country, but for LA what happened was everybody took a breath. So, at my firm, we probably close, I don’t know, I’m ballparking somewhere around 50 deals a month, right. And I expected them to start dropping out, like canceling, dropping out.
Johnathan: Well, literally dropping maybe.
Peter: Literally dropping, yeah. Well I haven’t had that happen thank God. But what happened was really, really extraordinary. Everything seized up in March, like no deals closed in March and then as the pandemic increased and rate dropped, the real estate buying public in L.A where like it’s okay. And I have actually seen these have been the busiest months, April, may, June, July, August have been the busiest months I have experienced in real estate since 2005.
Johnathan: Wow, [inaudible 04:41]. Over to you Robert.
Peter: It’s a banner year, as we say in England, Johnathan.
Robert: It is indeed. So, Peter you got into real estate around 2005, right?
Robert: Okay. That was the years leading up to the pandemic, so I do have a question for you, which is probably kind of like an outlier, but at that time you were an agent or did you get right into the business as a broker?
Peter: In 2005?
Peter: No, I joined as an agent. I kind of shuffled in, in the back room of Keller Williams. I didn’t really know where to go, I went and looked at a bunch of offices and they all felt like morgues and then I walked in Ms. Keller Williams in this part of LA and they had these pretty artistic pictures on the wall and I’m like well, at least there’s a glimmer of artistry here. Because I’d come out of the music business so I was surrounded by colorful people and big personalities and then I walked into all the brokerages and it felt like I was walking in a bank. And so I joined as an agent because I’ve always been very, very techie and I was in the music business professionally since I was 16 years old and was a long road and it was great and it was fantastic, I regret nothing and I did well, but then I saw the music business was about to have a cataclysmic change.
I heard about MP3s before they were even called MP3s and I’m like okay, okay, I’ve been in the game for about 18 years now so I’m going to kind of get out while I’m on top so I retired from music. I had a number one in 12 countries in the dance charts and I’m like, great. And I took the money that I’d made and I don’t really know where this came from, I’m originally from Leeds, even though my accent is a little bit kind of smashed to pieces now, and I remember my parents always saying oh, there’s money in property, there’s money in property.
And so, I was like, okay. And I remember working with my pal Juan Martinez, who’s a really talented producer here in L.A, and I said, I’ve got this check and I feel like I want to go get a new car or maybe I should buy a house. And he said to me, he said you should buy a house Pete. And those are some of the best words that were ever said to me. So, I bought my first property and I guess I was flipping before flipping really was a thing. And I bought it in these areas that everybody thought they were shithole cannon parts of LA…
Peter: But I kind of knew that the areas were close to other areas and I’m like well, it’s just a question of time before this pops and so I started investing did well, my music business people saw what I was doing, I wasn’t the only one trying to throw a rope over the wall of the music business so then… I am doing a live podcast. Do you want to say hello to everybody on Facebook? This is my son.
Peter: Covid homeschooling. And so, a lot of my pals who just didn’t relate to most people in real estate, they’re relating to me and I built my client base from that and that’s why I got my license. And then I’m a very binary dude, I’m all in or I’m all out. And I was like, if I try and do music and try and do real estate, I’m going to fail at both.
Peter: And it kind of reached the end with music so I knew it was going to collapse, so I’m just going to throw everything I’ve got into real estate and I kind of had a bit of a knack for it. I found the creative way to do it and I worked with my tribe and it was great. And I tried it the way I was instructed and it was very well-intentioned instruction, but it just didn’t work for me. So, I did it my way and then I ended up being the number one Keller Williams agent in LA after five years.
Robert: What is your way?
Peter: My way is only working strictly within a road that is narrow. Meaning I will not bend, I will not ponder, I will not do script, I will not mimic the way someone’s speaking to me, I will not do any of that horse shit because for me it just doesn’t work. I do take my fiduciary extremely seriously. So, if I’m working with someone and I’m mimicking their body language and I’m doing scripts, I’m abandoning my fiduciary responsibility. My fiduciary responsibility is to be absolutely raw, honest, transparent, put my neck out, guide them, even if I’m wrong, if my intentions are correct, they’re looking at me to walk them out of the wilderness, they’re not looking for me to play in the middle. And so that was my secret.
I was very just balls to the wall, I was like, you know, I know you want to buy a house in this street, but you know what I think this street is dog shit, so let’s kind of go over a couple of blocks because I just don’t like the fact that putting in these really dodgy new homes and a lot of my colleagues looked at me like I was bunkers. I was told to play in the middle and I’m like, I don’t want to do that, I’m going to fail or I’m going to flourish under my own volition. And if I… see, I don’t fear a failure, if I fail, I’m going to go off and open that surf shop and expresso bar on China beach in Vietnam. That’s plan B.
Robert: Which you’ve never had to take because if you’re the number one Keller Williams office in LA, you’re doing pretty good.
Peter: Yeah. I did well. I actually was very surprised. And this is no joke. I went to this ceremony, my office manager said you’re getting an award. And I’m like okay, I’ll go. So, I went to this big hotel and I sat in the back and they said and the number one Keller Williams agent is and they called my name and I’m like, wow, I actually couldn’t believe it. And then a few weeks after I got that, I saw an opportunity where again, I’m binary, I’m all in, or I’m all out. I’m like, I just got the number one status in LA of a company that’s got a pretty good rep at that time and so then I took that number one status and I formed my own company.
Robert: Okay. Which is PLG Estates? For those that are listening is PLG Estates, right?
Peter: Correct. Correct.
Robert: So, if you’re going to leave a brokerage and you’re going to do something on your own, because you’re leaving the security of a bigger brand and you’re going out, you’re being entrepreneurial. I’ve always thought that the only reason you do that is if you had a different marketing vision and you had a different training vision then the corporate company. Was that true in your case?
Peter: I hated everything corporate. I don’t like doctrine. And my way, isn’t the only way here. Real estate business it’s full of all flavors, all sizes, all everything right, there isn’t just one way to do it. My way, which works for Peter and won’t work for all of your listeners is I always liked to dance to the beat of my own drum because if I’m using generic, this and generic, that and generic colors and generic videos and generic this, I’m generic. I wanted to create my own marketing from scratch, which I did, my own brand from scratch, which I did my own flavor from scratch, which I did. And again, I didn’t fear PLG failing if it failed, awesome, I’ll go get the corner office at 99% of the local Keller Williams office.
Robert: Got you. And so how long has PLG Estates been a thing?
Peter: Ten years.
Robert: And I can see that you’ve got 30, is it 30 agents or is it…
Peter: Nearly 200.
Robert: 200 agents, okay. So, 200 agents, 10 years later, doing it your own way. What is like one of the number one marketing principles that you let’s say, talk to your agents about? Like I can tell that you you’re fiercely independent and it’s going to be authentic and that’s what I’m picking up. It’s like yourself, be authentic, but is there something that you instruct your entire 200 agent team to do?
Robert: What would that be?
Peter: Don’t do anything generic.
Peter: I also tell them online leads come last, that all the deals I have ever done, not all, but it’s a statistic anyway and I hope I’m not blowing holes in the podcast here, I’m just giving my opinion.
Peter: 86% of deals come from people you know, right that’s just the NAR statistic. So, I spend 86% of my time contacting my sphere of influence and I teach my guys to do the same and I teach them not to do drip campaigns, and I teach them not to do generic postcards and market reports. I teach them to have a personal one on one interaction with every single person in that database who they can remember something about. Because I get prospected all the time by plumbers and roofing companies and lawyers and whatever but when a friend of mine, well not even a friend, somebody calls me up and they go, hey, Pete, you know, I’m an electrician and I worked for Lez Thompson and Lez always said, nice things about you, so I wanted to introduce myself because Lez is retired now. Boom, that guy’s in. He’s in, he’s my electrician. I’ll at least give him a shot.
Peter: And that’s my philosophy on how to attract business.
Robert: Okay. And so, I haven’t cleared this with anybody, but do you mind if I ask you what the numbers are for PLG? So, you got 200 agents you’re here in Los Angeles. What was your gross, whatever sales you…?
Peter: We do about half a billion a year.
Peter: Maybe more.
Robert: Okay. And you’re all over the world because I’m on your website and I’m seeing Chateaux in France so you’re not just here, you’re everywhere.
Peter: I’m like the French resistance. I have an underground network of independents across the planet.
Robert: Okay. And…
Peter: Bonjour. You can tell that I’m very polarized in my belief system, right? For right, for wrong.
Peter: I’m like the guy in the trenches that is fully committed to going over the top when I blow the whistle and I will lead the charge. Now, we might all get shot, but if we do, I’m doing it with absolute commitment to my people.
Johnathan: We’re going to go for our break, when we come back, I’m going to be asking Peter about his technology stack. He said he didn’t like drip campaigns but I am going to ask him about how important is his digital marketing by his website and other digital assets to his company and to his marketing outreach. We’ll be back in a few moments’ folks,
We’re coming back. Got a friend of the show, Peter.
Johnathan: And he’s been telling us about his way. His way, his approach. So Peter, you said you don’t like these drip campaign systems, but how important is your digital marketing or your website and other digital outreach, your social media and what is some of your technology that your brokerage relies on to assist your agents in dealing with clients and maybe doing outreach to clients?
Peter: So, great question. When I say drip campaigns, I guess what I mean is I don’t like generic drip campaigns, [cross-talk 17:51] but I do like CRMs. I do like CRMs where you can load them with interesting stuff that you’ve created or what’s the word I’m looking for? Procured. What’s the word? What do people do in art galleries, they what’s it called the person that puts the art show on? Curator, right?
Johnathan: Right, curator.
Peter: I curate myself stuff that I think is really important to my people and then I might slide that into a CRM once a month, they get shot something of interest, right. We do have at PLG, which is not Peter [inaudible 18:28], but at PLG, we do have a newsletter because I think it’s important to let our database know our sales, right, we still have to promote our sales. But the number one thing, and I’ll get into the tech deck in a minute. There are some things that I really, really like. I believe the most important thing for us to promote right now is social media. That’s the gate of entry, the port of entry for everyone, certainly in LA is Instagram and Facebook.
A little bit of Tik Tok, a little bit Snapchat. So, I my ethos is start there because people are going look up your Instagram account first in L.A. If they like your Instagram account, they’re going to click the link in your profile to go to your website. So, I think websites are very, very important, I think the job of a website has changed, right? Because the attention span of people has changed. 12 years ago, we’d go on a website, we’d read every page, right?
We’d be like about us and this and that and this and that. Now to me, a website needs to be digestible in 12 seconds. I need to go on and go yep, yep. Got it. And if I want to then go to properties or maybe two or three other pages, I don’t think we need like reams and reams and reams of information anymore.
Johnathan: What does it mean by I’ve got it?
Peter: Meaning, I need to be at… I call it my… and I never do this, listeners, but I call this I need to be at, I understand this in the fast lane on the 101. That’s my rule of thumb for tech. And if someone sends me… like I get hit up as we all do by companies that are promoting their products, and they’ll send me a long email with 10 paragraphs and then a link to a video that’s 45 minutes long. I’m never watching it. I’m not actually getting past line number three. I represent, I believe the way that the mindset of the public in L.A, I don’t know about the rest of the country is.
Everybody’s moving very quickly and they have zero patients. So, if I’m looking at a product or a person or a company, I need to be able to know what it is… there’s a phrase that I learned, research from the BBC. This is an old TV phrase and it’s a product you and I know. I’m going to send you a $1.50 gift card to Starbucks if you get this right, Jonathan. Name the product when I give you the hook. Does what it says on the tin. Ronseal.
Johnathan: That’s [inaudible 21:11]
Peter: You got to call a friend. Oh, you don’t have any friends. So…
Johnathan: It’s an obvious isn’t it? Actually, I just live in my basement, my momma’s basement. I don’t actually live in America. It’s all a lie, folks.
Peter: All a lie. And so, it does what it says on the tin is something that I live and die by. Now, part of this…
Johnathan: You’re not related to Trump, are you?
Peter: Quite the opposite? I’m actually quite related to our Obama. Yeah, he’s my boy.
Johnathan: He’s my boy.
Peter: The thing being an old… I was an old… I don’t want to, I’m just rattling now, but being an old song writer, the way that I used to write songs, I was signed to EMI publishing as a songwriter and I always had to start from the hook and go out. I’d start with a great hook. She loves you, baby, whatever the hell the hook is and then I would build the song around it. So, when it comes to reviewing people and products, if it doesn’t do what it says on the tin in 12 seconds, they haven’t sold it to me so I’m out. And so, I need my company, what we need to do, what I teach agents to do is do what I do, what it says on the tin, in the briefest amount of time possible because if you get this, I don’t really know. I’ll come back to that later. You’re done. You lost them.
Johnathan: Well, it’s all saying on websites, people typically making apps, they tend to sell features. People don’t buy products or features, they buy products because out of fear or out of lust, basically, and or they buy something because it’s going to help them with a problem, it’s a problem solver. So, you got to tell them how you’re going to solve their problems. And you’ve got to get… and I suppose that’s the same with real estate. You got to really explained pretty quickly why you’re better than the competition, why clients should care really. Shouldn’t you?
Peter: Yeah. Interesting. And I’ll come back to the tech stack in a second as well. That’s another thing that I teach. I teach, never worry about the competition. I come from… I normally have the book lying around, but The Science of Getting Rich, which is a dreadful title, but it’s a great book by William Wallace…
Peter: Is for me the cornerstone of how to do business. Always give more than you expect to receive, always go the extra mile even if you don’t get something back. And there is always enough for everyone and competition should not drive the market. We can aspire to be the number one agent, we can aspire to be the number one brokerage, but there is more than enough for everyone to get everything they want. And so, I never teach the agents to go out and say, why they’re better than someone else, I teach them to go out and say why they are perfect for the job.
Johnathan: Yeah, I understand where you’re coming from because I don’t worry much about the competition, because there’s not much I can do about it, I can only do things about my own performance.
Johnathan: I can’t do anything about the competition. Then if somebody disappears only another competitor will appear and they might be a more efficient competitor so I just don’t worry about it. About your tech stack, what do you use in your brokerage and what do you like? And maybe you can give a quick insight, something you thought was going to be the bee’s knees that didn’t actually work out that well.
Peter: Okay. I can. All right. So, I’m a big fan of having a small arsenal of tools. I find when there are too many tools, one gets lost. It’s like, what does this… does this do that? So, one of the tools that I love and adore and was an early adopter of, as soon as I could get my hands on, it was Real Scout. I think Real Scout for the agents is banging. If you’re an agent and you don’t know what Real Scout is, Real Scout gives you the ability to insert yourself between your local MLS and the buyers. And they still get all the listings, which look beautifully beautiful and far more beautiful than they’re doing L.A sent from Real Scout. But then the bonus is you get to see who looked at what, how long they looked at it and how many times they looked at it.
So, if you have 20 or 30 buyers that you’re working with, now the mystery is gone as to who is actually active and who isn’t. So, it allows you to focus your efforts on the people that are maybe your A’s and your B’s and then the C’s and D’s, you still cater to but you know that they’re not quite moving as fast so the mystery of who’s a real buyer is gone. That’s number one, everybody in the brokerage has that. I also got the suite from HomeSpotter. So, I’ve got HomeSpotter mobile app, which is white labeled to PLG. Along with that, I got Boost and then I also got Spacio for open houses, so all of the guys get that.
Johnathan: What is Spacio really?
Peter: Spacio is an iPad based open house sign in sheet, which of course we can’t use now and what it does is it sets up clients on alerts, and you get alerted when they’re looking at something that you’ve sent. And it’s normally related to the house that they came and saw. And so it kind of auto prospect people at open houses for a minute, so that’s good. And then you transfer them into Real Scout.
Johnathan: Can I just quickly just ask you a quick question about open houses? I’m still a big… obviously in the pandemic you can’t do, you’ve got to do virtual open houses maybe, but without a pandemic being here, I’m still a great fan of open houses, but so many in the industry really shit on open houses. They really say they’re total freaking waste of time. They’re really totally negative about them. But I think they’re great way of building up your database if you’ve got a process, which you have. Do you agree? You still love open houses.
Peter: I love them. And I love them for a whole multitude of reasons, which is I’m still a practicing agent as well. My wife and I, we do lots of deals a year ourselves, probably out a 50 to 100 deals a year. And I look at it as an opportunity for me to then get some of the newer guys who don’t have business, they can sit my open houses and whoever walks in is there’s. I know some agents and I’m not saying whether it’s right or wrong, they have junior agents sit their opens and then take 50% of the buyers they find, never been a fan of that. I’m like if someone’s going to give up that Sunday, because it’s not just three hours, it’s five hours. It’s getting ready, putting the signs out, it’s the whole day. If someone’s going to give up their day, whilst they’re trying to get a foothold in the industry, they should get the whole commission.
And so, I’m a big fan of it and in L.A as well, I don’t know what it’s like around the rest of the country, but people like to come and look at things incognito in L.A. They’ll go and look, everybody has an agent, but they’ll go and look on their own and then call the agent and go you know, I like 123 Green Street. What do you think? So, I think the market is better with open.
Johnathan: Yeah. Right. Thanks for that. That’s a code, I totally agree with you. And you heard it from a really successful broker, open houses, still work guys and ladies. Back onto your stack.
Peter: Yes. So obviously social media manager, I think is something that everyone should have. Social media by nature was something that was organic and we were just sharing our thoughts and pictures and what have you. Obviously now is I look at social media as that, but also as your own personal PR company. And so, we should be planning out our social calendar weeks, if not months in advance. So, not every little post, but I think if you’re an agent you need what I call the anchor posts, you need at least three real estate related posts a week that are informational, that are great, that are thought through that are concise, that give information that people can’t find on their own.
And then around that you can have puppies and coffees and ballroom dancing and what have you. So, Hootsuite is great. I like Iconosquare, I mean those are the two that I use.
Peter: And then if you have video editing now, I have been a big video guy for a long…
Johnathan: Well it’s something we keep plugging all the time, Peter, on the show.
Peter: So, if you go on iPhone, which I’m speaking in now, it is a ridiculously fabulous, beautiful interface for recording video. And then all you need; I know this sounds a bit dodgy or you need is one of these. This is a Shure mv88. It plugs in the iPhone; you stick it on a selfie stick and you have got a full-on semiprofessional video suite. And then if you really want it, because I’m a big final cut guy on my laptop, I just switched. And I actually moved to Luma Fusion, which is called Luma Touch now on my iPad pro because I never liked being chained to my laptops and now, I have all my videos that I’m editing in this. And when my brain is just melting from being on calls or showing houses or sitting with agents, and I just need to kind of do something different for a minute, I’ll break this out and I’ll edit 10 minutes of a video and then I’ll put out a blog two to four times a month, which I know people watch, which is where I got business from.
Johnathan: Yeah. We’re going to wrap up the podcast part of the show, Peter, because I like to keep it at about 30 minutes but if It’s okay, you could stay on for another 10 minutes.
Peter: Yeah sure.
Johnathan: That would be between 10 and 11. I would imagine you’ve given us an hour of your time. Peter’s extremely busy and I do appreciate him agreeing coming on the show because I know he’s dealing with a lot of staff at the same time because he’s a successful broker. So, we’re going to wrap up the podcast part of show. Peter, what’s the best way for people to find out more about you, your ideas and what you’re up to Peter?
Peter: So, I live on Instagram and you can go to at Peter Lorimer, that’s Peter L O R I M E R. You can just Google as well. Peter Lorimer and I should pop up. Me, that’s me and a dodgy soccer player that pop up, I’m not the soccer player.
Johnathan: No. he’s not the dodgy soccer player.
Peter: But Instagram is the best way. And then my email is firstname.lastname@example.org. If you want to reach out through email.
Johnathan: It’s well worth following Peter because he still got really active, even though he’s successful, he’s still hungry. He’s still very active in his comments and his views so it’s well worth still following him Peter on those platforms. So, Robert what’s the best way for people to find out more about you and your views and what you are up to?
Robert: You can always find out more about email@example.com.
Johnathan: And if you want to see the bonus content that we’re going to just have with Peter. The best way is to go to the Mail-Right YouTube channel, do a search for a Mail-Right. And you’ll be able to see the whole interview on YouTube.
Robert: I want to throw a wind up into there though. I think that if you’re okay with it, what I’d like the bonus content contents be, because I know every single agent that’s ever been an agent has always wanted their own show. Peter has one. So, I want to ask question.
Johnathan: Well yes.
Robert: I want to ask the question of, did it generate you business? But let’s save the answer…
Johnathan: Yeah, we wait for the answer in the bonus content [inaudible 33:59] which you’ll be able to see on the Mail-Right Youtube channel. We’ll see you next week where hopefully it’s going to be a great internal discussion about tech and real estate between me and Robert, or we have another great guest like Peter. We’ll see you next week folks. Bye.